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Ranger and Explorer/mountaineer rear end /differential info       #: 163
 Moderated by: NoPower, Mike69, MaDMaXX Page:  First Page Previous Page  1  2  3  Next Page Last Page  
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 Posted: Sat Nov 18th, 2017 12:39 am
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JAMMAN

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To clarify the clarification LOL what you are showing are 2 8.8 31 spline native ranger axles with the torsen style guts?

If I can eventually understand it then anyone can!



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 Posted: Sat Nov 18th, 2017 11:14 am
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JAMMAN wrote: To clarify the clarification LOL what you are showing are 2 8.8 31 spline native ranger axles with the torsen style guts?

If I can eventually understand it then anyone can!
That's right! I wish I had a regular 8.8 to photograph but I got rid of mine.



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 Posted: Sat Nov 18th, 2017 11:21 am
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JAMMAN

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This one is rough, this is the D2 still under my soon to be gutted expo. It's supposed to go in my V8 project but I'm probably going to look for a torsen now to keep from messing with spring perches and shock mounts:












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 Posted: Sat Nov 18th, 2017 10:31 pm
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So I come to ask, besides welding the tubes to the differential housing, making or using an existing truss from say a Jeep 8.8 (possibly) who still offers any chromoly axle upgrades? maybe even with different bolt pattern options possibly?

Can one upgrade all of the gearing in the rear; strength wise as well as regearing, by swapping out the guts for a Detroit locker or TruTrac?



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 Posted: Sun Nov 19th, 2017 12:57 am
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Undrstm8ed wrote: So I come to ask, besides welding the tubes to the differential housing, making or using an existing truss from say a Jeep 8.8 (possibly) who still offers any chromoly axle upgrades? maybe even with different bolt pattern options possibly?

Can one upgrade all of the gearing in the rear; strength wise as well as regearing, by swapping out the guts for a Detroit locker or TruTrac?
Both Detroit/Eaton and Trutrac offer LS options that are much stronger than the OEM. A regear will require a reflash of your computer if you have an automatic transmission. With a Detroit/Eaton or Trutrac the weak link becomes the axle. If you want a bulletproof axle get a 9" ford cut to the Ranger width and put a Detroit/Eaton or Trutrac in it. 



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 Posted: Sun Nov 19th, 2017 01:01 am
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MaDMaXX

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I think we only have the one choice in the Detroit, right? I didn't see 3 choices that will fit the Ranger.



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 Posted: Sun Nov 19th, 2017 02:16 am
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Tsquare wrote: Undrstm8ed wrote: So I come to ask, besides welding the tubes to the differential housing, making or using an existing truss from say a Jeep 8.8 (possibly) who still offers any chromoly axle upgrades? maybe even with different bolt pattern options possibly?

Can one upgrade all of the gearing in the rear; strength wise as well as regearing, by swapping out the guts for a Detroit locker or TruTrac?
Both Detroit/Eaton and Trutrac offer LS options that are much stronger than the OEM. A regear will require a reflash of your computer if you have an automatic transmission. With a Detroit/Eaton or Trutrac the weak link becomes the axle. If you want a bulletproof axle get a 9" ford cut to the Ranger width and put a Detroit/Eaton or Trutrac in it. 


I think the Explorer 31 spline 8.8 could hold its own with axle upgrades and the Eaton/Detroit LS or Lockers even and then adding some truss work. As you may put it, it doesn't need to be IED proof but if it was.. then I'm on track if you know what I mean. And thankfully, I @dmin manual trans trucks. lol  I know the automatic has quite a few advantages to it but the manual is still more fun to drive IMO.


Does the Explorer use same or similar Dana 35 for a front axle? I think the idea of keeping my Dana 35 axle and going the route of Dana 44 hubs and spindles will satisfy 98% of my needs and wants..



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"The slave is held most securely when he is held by the chains of his own will and of his own fears, and when he is locked down by his own slavish desires for a comfortable life." - Michael Bunker

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"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom, must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it." - Thomas Paine


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 Posted: Sun Nov 19th, 2017 03:00 am
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JAMMAN

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Tsquare wrote:  If you want a bulletproof axle get a 9" ford cut to the Ranger width and put a Detroit/Eaton or Trutrac in it. 

This 1000%



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 Posted: Sun Nov 19th, 2017 03:01 am
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And make your own axles out of 300M



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 Posted: Sat Nov 25th, 2017 11:53 am
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Going to post yet again... For tricks 2007 and newer, the FX4 package let you pick and choose parts from the Level 2 package so you could have some of the perks and not all. This means that 2007 and newer trucks could have the Torsen rear axle without being a level 2. 


The best part about this change means that the axle finally got its own identifier... R8 (4.10 LS w/Torsen)


Just came to mind and thought that'd be helpful for the chart.



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 Posted: Sat Nov 25th, 2017 12:46 pm
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I think in the end we should have the most informative chart of any forum I have seen so far.

Time to start working on the tech pages,this will be the first article up since it is the most complex.



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 Posted: Fri Dec 8th, 2017 09:31 pm
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RiggerWings
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JAMMAN wrote: Most articles and forums agree that if the ranger had a 4 cyl or a non 4.0 V6 it had a 7.5" rear gear. The 4.0 has the 8.8" gear but it is a 28 spline axle, not a 31 like the Explorer/Mountaineer. If anyone has found different please tell me, but remember the rear end might have been switched out in your ranger so be sure please.


I have a 2011 with 3.73s, my axle code is 96. Upon adding earlier rear blocks to mine to add some lift I had to order different U-bolts than I got with the blocks. I realized I have the thicker axle tubes (3.25" IIRC), which means 31 spline right? Unless Ford decided to use the thicker tubes with the same 28-spline axles. 

I also changed out the axle bearings and seals in the rear when I bought it. I didn't think to count the splines at the time. The seals I ordered online were too small, but supposedly for an 8.8" still. I ended up going to the local auto parts store and getting the correct seals. 

Overall, the 28-splines were a bit thinner than the 31-splines right? I have the FoMoCo part number for the axle bearings if someone has a way to cross reference that. Its E3TZ-1225-AA. 

The OD of the bearing is the exact same as the bearings I replaced in my 8.8" 2008 Mustang GT (I used the old Mustang bearing to aid me in installing the new Ranger bearing).  Again, not sure what spline that is either.  



edit: I'm interested in going with some 4.10's eventually. It would be nice to find an LS rear end but I think I'll just end up getting re-geared. If I happen to find a decent 31 spline rear end, I should be able to assume the front diff will swap over to mine as well, right? Are there different size/spline front drive axles (CV joints) or were they all the same?

Also, guys looking for LS or a locking diff can likely fit one from a Mustang. The V6 (4.0) from '05-09 had the 7.5" rear end and the GTs (4.6L) had the 8.8". The axle housings will obviously be different but the internals should be identical, given the correct splines. 


Last edited on Fri Dec 8th, 2017 09:44 pm by RiggerWings



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RiggerWings wrote:
I have a 2011 with 3.73s, my axle code is 96. Upon adding earlier rear blocks to mine to add some lift I had to order different U-bolts than I got with the blocks. I realized I have the thicker axle tubes (3.25" IIRC), which means 31 spline right? Unless Ford decided to use the thicker tubes with the same 28-spline axles. 

edit: I'm interested in going with some 4.10's eventually. It would be nice to find an LS rear end but I think I'll just end up getting re-geared. If I happen to find a decent 31 spline rear end, I should be able to assume the front diff will swap over to mine as well, right? Are there different size/spline front drive axles (CV joints) or were they all the same?

Also, guys looking for LS or a locking diff can likely fit one from a Mustang. The V6 (4.0) from '05-09 had the 7.5" rear end and the GTs (4.6L) had the 8.8". The axle housings will obviously be different but the internals should be identical, given the correct splines. 


This is something I forgot to cover in all my mass posts yet slightly outlined it...

2010+ TRUCKS (ONES THAT HAVE FACTORY DISCS) HAVE 31 SPLINE AXLES. That means 7.5 or 8.8, both rear ends used 31 spline axles.


2010+ Axles also can not (or at least have not yet) been swapped into an older truck as the ABS setup is different. These trucks instead of a 3 line ABS system (2 front wheels and a sensor in the rear diff) used a 4 way ABS system (one sensor at each wheel) with no spot for a sensor in the diff. 


On a similar note, to swap axles into a 2010+ truck from something different (be it Ranger or Explorer) you would also have a few issues to fix. I personally think the easiest axle to swap in would be the 31 spline FX4 axle I ranted on for multiple posts in this thread as the only thing needed would be to change the orientation of the brake mounting brackets and then swap on the stock disc brake setup to keep a working ABS system. Next easiest would be an Expo setup as you have to do that and then do what you normally have to for swapping that axle into a Ranger.


As for a LS setup, I would personally set out to find a 2010+ truck rear 8.8 (it is surprisingly easy between Ebay and local yards to find a decent priced one that needs minor work) as the 8.8, especially in 31 spline, is way better supported in the aftermarket world.



Next, Rangers from 98-00 used a special type of locking hubs, which had a front axle that was also a bit different than the ones that followed despite being the same overall axle.


01-02 trucks used a very similar axle that 98-00 trucks used but it was setup to be a live axle. 


03 was a bastard year for 4x4, sometime in the year (the date is argued about) the front rotors went from being 11ish inches to 12ish. The only change here was the hubs out, they had new mounts for new calipers (both of which are what need to be replaced to upgrade 01/02/03 trucks to the larger diameter rotors).


04 trucks on remained the same front axle setup until 2011.


In short, to replace your front axle, all you need is a replacement axle from a 01 or newer truck.


Something that just occurred to me... If you have a 4x4 truck, you have a 8.8 rear end... Not sure why I thought you had a 7.5 but oh well.



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 Posted: Sat Dec 9th, 2017 03:03 am
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Let's just say i wanted LSD in my '02 2WD 8.8 - and didn't want to spend $500 on a new insert, and don't care about changing the back end, only wanting LSD.....



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 Posted: Sat Dec 9th, 2017 03:48 am
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MaDMaXX wrote: Let's just say i wanted LSD in my '02 2WD 8.8 - and didn't want to spend $500 on a new insert, and don't care about changing the back end, only wanting LSD.....Cheapest option would be (Lets pretend you have a 8.8 with 4.10 open gearing) looking at local classifieds (either Craigslist or Facebook Marketplace) for people parting out Rangers. Ask for a picture of the door tag to find the code that matches what you have but with LS (so with my example a 4.10 LS rear end) and when you go to check it out, test the clutch pack to see if it is shot or not (I can not remember how to do this but I hope someone chimes in)


If you can not find one being parted out try junkyards, mine sell axles anywhere from $75 to $300 so even that is under $500.

Last edited on Sat Dec 9th, 2017 03:49 am by Kealel



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 Posted: Sat Dec 9th, 2017 03:50 am
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Hah, i actually have an 8.8 4.10 :)

Is there not necessarily something that i can just open the diff and 'bolt in' something 'better' ?



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 Posted: Sat Dec 9th, 2017 03:58 am
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Yes, you can replace the entire carrier on the inside of the diff for a Torsen (limited slip) or even one with lockers. That could get pricey, especially if someone is doing the work for you. Diff work is never cheap. Changing gearing, (as I did on my Mustang) wasn't too tough but the shimming was. I couldn't get it good enough and had a slight noise. I then took it to Ford to get shimmed correctly costing me $750.



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 Posted: Sat Dec 9th, 2017 04:04 am
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MaDMaXX wrote: Hah, i actually have an 8.8 4.10 :)

Is there not necessarily something that i can just open the diff and 'bolt in' something 'better' ?
Yes, you could do what RiggerWings mentioned above, Diff work (to the inexperienced - no offence) can be quite the challenge and cause major issues... Unless you are positive you can get it right and are alright with not driving the truck until you are certain everything is installed correctly, it is best to leave the work to insured professionals, which gets pricey fast. There is also such a thing as a "Lunchbox Locker" but before I did research on those I decided to go with a whole new axle. From what I hear though they seem to be easy to put in and forget about.



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 Posted: Sat Dec 9th, 2017 04:25 am
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Sheesh, yeah, i'm a complete noob for diffs, so absolutely no offence taken :(

I think i'll struggle to justify this based on cost of actually having it fitted. I don't *need* the truck most of the year, but will need it during inclement months, half the point of getting it.



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 Posted: Sat Dec 9th, 2017 04:30 am
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I feel the same way. I really want 4.10s, and the best way seems to be finding one from a 2010-2011 or just getting new gears installed. Either way, probably pricey.

You never know though, you may luck out and find a LS rear end. My '02 FX4 had the Torsen LS and 4.10s. Maybe look for an Fx4.



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I have a question regarding the dia of s 31 spline shaft vs a 28 spline shaft.. anyone have that info??



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"The slave is held most securely when he is held by the chains of his own will and of his own fears, and when he is locked down by his own slavish desires for a comfortable life." - Michael Bunker

"Mundus vult decipi, ergo decipiatur. Mundus vult decipi, ergo decipiatur" - ~ attributed to Petronius (Gaius Petronius Arbiter (ca. 27–66 AD))
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"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom, must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it." - Thomas Paine


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 Posted: Fri Dec 22nd, 2017 01:39 am
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The actual axle shaft or the axle housing? Typically you can measure the housing and it'll let you know which you have.

The larger 31 splines have an axle housing of about 3.25". I would imagine if you wrap a string around it and measure between two marks, then divide by pie (3.14) it'll tell you which one you have.

About 10 1/4" circumference would be the larger 3.25" housings which equals 31-spline.

Then again, I'm not sure if axle housing sizes differed with the 7.5" rear end. I would imagine all those are 28-spline, not sure though.

Last edited on Fri Dec 22nd, 2017 01:44 am by RiggerWings



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2018 Harley Davidson Road Glide Special, the toy
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 Posted: Fri Dec 22nd, 2017 06:14 am
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Undrstm8ed
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You actually confirmed some of what I found out. The 31 spline shaft is larger and where the strength is coming from. The 28 Spline 8.8 has a shaft tube of I think a curly one over 2.75" VS the 31 Splines 8.8 at the 3.25" you stated.

Since i asked this question I have made up my mind I need to find a Explorer Rear end preferably a 95' but If not I am ok with the 10.25" drums still too.

I've also found axle upgrades for both 8.8 but since the 31 spline will likely handle everything I'll need along with 4.56 gears, and the upgraded maganese axle upgrades for the rear. With the same 4.56 gearing in the Dana 35 modded with Dana 44 knuckles on the front I think I'll be okay for what my needs are.

So far that's what my plans are.



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 Posted: Wed Sep 18th, 2019 07:17 pm
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Mike69

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01-02 trucks used a very similar axle that 98-00 trucks used but it was setup to be a live axle. 

Kealel, IIRC 2000 Rangers built after 1/00 had the live axle setup, as my 2000 Ranger 4x4 was built 3/00 & has the live axle f/e.



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08 Escape 4x4(spare)
00 Ranger Extd Cab 4x4 4.0 OHV, Auto(My DD)
99 Explorer Sport 4x4 4.0 SOHC, Auto( Wife's DD)
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 Posted: Wed Sep 18th, 2019 07:31 pm
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Kealel
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Mike69 wrote:

01-02 trucks used a very similar axle that 98-00 trucks used but it was setup to be a live axle. 

Kealel, IIRC 2000 Rangers built after 1/00 had the live axle setup, as my 2000 Ranger 4x4 was built 3/00 & has the live axle f/e.

As far as I know, you're correct. My extent of knowledge for the 4x4 systems is 2001+, which is all live axles.



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