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The "original" problem       #: 1331
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 Posted: Sat Oct 13th, 2018 12:54 am
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JAMMAN

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Well the problem the previous owner of the little green truck I bought told me about has surfaced.

Starts bucking, tach drops during the bucking. Kind of like a crank sensor or a bad key switch.

I have to find the problem because if it is the key switch it will plague the motor swap also.

Going to wiggle a few things around this weekend and look for pinched stuff from whatever accident it had.

Worse case scenario I'll drive around with a volt meter hooked to various parts of the ignition system. Did that with a daytona and a 99 CRV.



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 Posted: Sat Oct 13th, 2018 04:31 am
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I had a car with a bad coil. It would work fine until it warmed up then it would surge and act like it was gonna die. Is it like that? Or is it like trying to start a manual in second from a stop? Either one could be very dangerous if they happen when you are entering or trying to cross traffic. Be safe!!!



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 Posted: Sat Oct 13th, 2018 01:52 pm
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410customs

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bucking? as in the engine is running smoothly then all of a sudden begins to miss badly, then recovers?



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 Posted: Sat Oct 13th, 2018 01:57 pm
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JAMMAN

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It cuts out completely momentarily tach drops.



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 Posted: Sat Oct 13th, 2018 02:52 pm
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battery cables/terminals (especially negative)
Ignition switch (Not the lock and tumbler assembly, but the column mounted ignition switch)
Crank sensor

After being around alot of Gen II trucks my $$$$ is on the crank sensor
coil packs usually go out in banks (3 cyl at a time) and coil packs usually fail only after electrical issues. Like if car toys installs a stereo poorly, or if a 12V accessory port develops a dead short.
I have seen 3 bad coil packs in 15+ years
The Ford DIS ignition is bomb proof, thanks goodness after the whole TFI module problem the 2.9L had

Last edited on Sat Oct 13th, 2018 02:56 pm by 410customs



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 Posted: Sat Oct 13th, 2018 02:59 pm
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JAMMAN

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Funny you should say that, it did throw a code I was just out there poking around and had decided to:

1. Replace the crank sensor.

2. While I'm "down there" make sure I was on TDC when I installed the cam synch.

I installed the cam synch by taking the alignment tool, rotating the engine till it fell in to place on the old one, pulled the synch and verified there was no gear wear (was going to verify TDC if there was gear wear) but the gear looked spooky fresh so I just dropped the new synch in with tool atop and tightened.

I did attempt to verify TDC but the tone ring was soooo rusted I could not see the mark.

So between these two unless I have a wire pinched which does not look like the case I bet that cures it.

Then I will feel right about pulling it and selling it to someone.



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00 XLT 4WD RCSB 3.GO! Jalapeño
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99 XL 4WD RCSB 3.0, has no name yet
00 XLT 2WD RC Steppie 2.5 Dee Dee

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 Posted: Sat Oct 13th, 2018 04:01 pm
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I like to pull #1 plug, turn engine over, use my finger or piece of paper to verify compression stroke (air rushes past) and then watch the piston travel to the top, as soon as the piston reaches to top of its travel and starts to drop you stop. Look at balancer and confirm you are at TDC, then drop in cam synch

NOW with that said, as long as you get the cam synchronizer on the correct tooth on the camshaft with the flag aligned, then the angle it sits at in the engine is not critical.
You should get a cam timing code (few drive cycles), high idle, or misfire, sometimes a long crank is cam synch is off a tooth or 180 out

Last edited on Sat Oct 13th, 2018 04:02 pm by 410customs



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 Posted: Sat Oct 13th, 2018 04:12 pm
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JAMMAN

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Well I have a problem,I might have to pull plug 1 because there are no timing marks on my balancer. Really. I just wire wheeled the entire hub 360 and there are no marks.

As best I can figure from internet pictures on a 3.0 facing the engine it is the 5th tooth counter clockwise of the gap.

Anyone have one with marks on it that can confirm this? 2 pictures I found clearly had it 5th tooth CCW from the timing gap (one tooth removed to set origin).



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00 XLT 2WD RCSB 5.0 swap Gherkin
00 XLT 4WD XCSB 4.0 G2
00 XLT 4WD RCSB 3.GO! Jalapeño
00 XLT 4WD RCSB Steppie 3.blown. Mistake
99 XL 4WD RCSB 3.0, has no name yet
00 XLT 2WD RC Steppie 2.5 Dee Dee

ALL Amazon Green Metallic
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 Posted: Sat Oct 13th, 2018 04:25 pm
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I have a 3.0 outside ill go look see



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 Posted: Sat Oct 13th, 2018 05:45 pm
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JAMMAN

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Thanks bud.

I put the crank sensor in and did my second heater resistor in 2 months (I should keep a couple in stock).

Took it for a nice long ride and it seems to run a LOT better and did not cut out. I'll take it to work tomorrow and give it the test.

The new crank sensor had 100 ohms more resistance than the new one, probably was going bad.



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00 XLT 2WD RCSB 5.0 swap Gherkin
00 XLT 4WD XCSB 4.0 G2
00 XLT 4WD RCSB 3.GO! Jalapeño
00 XLT 4WD RCSB Steppie 3.blown. Mistake
99 XL 4WD RCSB 3.0, has no name yet
00 XLT 2WD RC Steppie 2.5 Dee Dee

ALL Amazon Green Metallic
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 Posted: Sat Oct 13th, 2018 06:14 pm
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sure sounds like a crank sensor
assuming you are not losing fuel pressure (not too likely if is recovers)
Ill get a pic of the 3.0 damper when possible

Why do you lose heater reisistors? Is this the rheostat mounted in the HVAC box engine side? Fan only works on high?
I will only use Ford for those the aftermarket ones not the greatest
Electrical issues on larger circuits like heater can spike and cause issues with crank sensor, coil pack, pcm and more..... something to think about

Last edited on Sat Oct 13th, 2018 06:16 pm by 410customs



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 Posted: Sat Oct 13th, 2018 07:34 pm
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I get the resistor and a pig tail as a package, it isn't the resistor that goes bad it is the connector corroding to the resistor. You simply cannot get them off so I just take the 2 bolts out and clip the wires.

Must be a regional thing today is the 5th I have replaced out of 6 rangers and I have 2 more I haven't even tried yet.

And yes it is the one or 2 fan speeds only thing.



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00 XLT 2WD RCSB 5.0 swap Gherkin
00 XLT 4WD XCSB 4.0 G2
00 XLT 4WD RCSB 3.GO! Jalapeño
00 XLT 4WD RCSB Steppie 3.blown. Mistake
99 XL 4WD RCSB 3.0, has no name yet
00 XLT 2WD RC Steppie 2.5 Dee Dee

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 Posted: Sat Oct 13th, 2018 08:26 pm
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PITA
white lithium grease the inside and backside of those connectors



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 Posted: Sat Oct 13th, 2018 11:24 pm
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JAMMAN

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I found a huge shortcut... remove the cruise control first. LOL why didn't I think of that before.



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00 XLT 2WD RCSB 5.0 swap Gherkin
00 XLT 4WD XCSB 4.0 G2
00 XLT 4WD RCSB 3.GO! Jalapeño
00 XLT 4WD RCSB Steppie 3.blown. Mistake
99 XL 4WD RCSB 3.0, has no name yet
00 XLT 2WD RC Steppie 2.5 Dee Dee

ALL Amazon Green Metallic
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 Posted: Sat Oct 13th, 2018 11:25 pm
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JAMMAN

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That's the last 2 I did



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00 XLT 2WD RCSB 5.0 swap Gherkin
00 XLT 4WD XCSB 4.0 G2
00 XLT 4WD RCSB 3.GO! Jalapeño
00 XLT 4WD RCSB Steppie 3.blown. Mistake
99 XL 4WD RCSB 3.0, has no name yet
00 XLT 2WD RC Steppie 2.5 Dee Dee

ALL Amazon Green Metallic
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 Posted: Sun Oct 14th, 2018 03:17 am
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Connectors
In radio frequency low power installations, in particular at low frequencies and/or when the connector has very little air gap, completely flooding the connector is perfectly acceptable. Flooding a connector is not acceptable at high power, because most greases will carburize when subjected to an arc. Greases also change the dielectric constant, lowering the dielectric constant in the connector. This may create an impedance bump at very high frequencies, the problem's effect on the system being entirely dependent on the length of the bump in electrical degrees and the amount of the bump. (Not all things that show on a TDR meaningfully alter performance, but they do indicate a potential problem.)
In regular low voltage multiple-pin circuit connectors, such as automotive applications, flooding with a proper insulating grease of low-viscosity dielectric grease is perfectly acceptable unless a manufacturer recommends against it. The grease should have good stability and not contain metals in any form, and be specifically designed for use as a dielectric grease. This generally is a silicone dielectric grease, although some Teflon based greases are acceptable.
In single low-voltage terminals or connections, such as metal-to-metal joints, grounds, or battery posts, almost any pure grease of light viscosity will be acceptable. Caution should be used with greases containing metallic powders to be sure any metal is compatible with the embedded grease metal. Connection enhancement from embedded metal powder is very minor, if it exists at all, and unless you match the grease to the connector material, risk of interaction with base metals might increase.
In single high voltage connections, such as spark plug boots or other high voltage connectors (x-ray, neon sign, or HV power lines), only pure dielectric silicone greases should be used. Generally a light coating or wipe is all that is required. Dielectric grease will actually increase voltage breakdown across insulators, especially in the presence of moisture. Never use or allow a metalized grease around HV connections.    
The important physical characteristic is that any grease must have low enough viscosity to push out of the way at contact points, be water or liquid resistant, and be stable enough to remain in place as a protectant against moisture and air for a long time. It will not do any good to apply a grease that does not do required functions of excluding air and moisture, and lubricating the interface to prevent galling or fretting, for extended periods of time.
Contrary to Internet rumors, advertisements, and articles low viscosity silicone dielectric grease will NOT insulate pressure connections. Silicone dielectric grease will prolong connection life as well as, and have just as good conduction performance, as a properly selected metallic powder grease (conductive grease). On the other hand, and improperly selected "conductive" grease can actually cause connection problems.

From: https://www.w8ji.com/dielectric_grease_vs_conductive_grease.htm


Buy yourself some. You'll be glad you did. If it melts and oozes out of the connector then look for a higher temp version, usually containing more pure silicone: https://shop.advanceautoparts.com/p/permatex-dielectric-tune-up-grease-33-oz-81150/7010435-p?c3ch=PLA&c3nid=7010435-P&adtype=pla_with_promotion&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI1LWnvPmE3gIVwcDACh3wOQFjEAQYAyABEgJUkPD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds&dclid=CPXnt6n7hN4CFVJgAQod3kMOCw



GB :)

Last edited on Sun Oct 14th, 2018 03:18 am by Bird76Mojo

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 Posted: Sun Oct 14th, 2018 09:28 pm
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OK the "original problem" still exists.

Ran great till it warmed up.

I need to check the cam synch for position then off to another theory. The coil theory sounds good and would be easy to check.

If I'm not mistaken (please correct me if so) the coil pack on the 3.0 and the 4.0 OHV are the same?



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00 XLT 2WD RCSB 5.0 swap Gherkin
00 XLT 4WD XCSB 4.0 G2
00 XLT 4WD RCSB 3.GO! Jalapeño
00 XLT 4WD RCSB Steppie 3.blown. Mistake
99 XL 4WD RCSB 3.0, has no name yet
00 XLT 2WD RC Steppie 2.5 Dee Dee

ALL Amazon Green Metallic
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 Posted: Mon Oct 15th, 2018 01:40 pm
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yes
V6 coil pack is a V6 coil pack for Ford.
They make V6 and V4. Two v4 = V8
Same coil packs otherwise.

Factory packs the backside of the connectors with white lithium grease, not die electric, so that's what I use.

Do you have a scanner?

Other thing to watch on the scanner is the IAC temps
Might do a sweep test on the TPS too make sure no dead spots
What happens to fuel pressure when this occurs?



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 Posted: Wed Oct 17th, 2018 12:16 am
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410customs wrote:
What happens to fuel pressure when this occurs?
Bingo, smart dude.

I took it to work today, bucking all the way there after it warmed up. I replaced the coil yesterday so that's a crank sensor and a coil.

Was finally below empty, so I took it to the gas station. While idling it was dipping almost to zero on the RPM's.

I filled it up.

It quit doing it. Then I remember the first thing I did after I replaced the cam synch was take it and fill it up.

It only did what it does when the fuel gets low and it gets warm. I have other things to check now.

I'm going to throw a fuel pressure gauge on it but I think it has something to do with the pickup tube probably misplaced during the accident.



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00 XLT 2WD RCSB 5.0 swap Gherkin
00 XLT 4WD XCSB 4.0 G2
00 XLT 4WD RCSB 3.GO! Jalapeño
00 XLT 4WD RCSB Steppie 3.blown. Mistake
99 XL 4WD RCSB 3.0, has no name yet
00 XLT 2WD RC Steppie 2.5 Dee Dee

ALL Amazon Green Metallic
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 Posted: Wed Oct 17th, 2018 01:41 am
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I've had more than one fuel pump come loose after hard hits offroading. The rubber tube/hose that connects the pump to the pickup unit tubing slid off just enough to leak pressure but still run. You'd think the supplied hose clamps would hold it but...


GB :)

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 Posted: Wed Oct 17th, 2018 01:49 am
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Gives me a reason to take the bed off :) I want to any way to paint the frame.



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00 XLT 4WD RCSB 3.GO! Jalapeño
00 XLT 4WD RCSB Steppie 3.blown. Mistake
99 XL 4WD RCSB 3.0, has no name yet
00 XLT 2WD RC Steppie 2.5 Dee Dee

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 Posted: Wed Oct 17th, 2018 01:52 am
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If I had that to do all over again, I wouldn't do it. 90% of the time people do it, no matter how clean they think they get it (me included) it's not clean enough to paint without holding in moisture in the future. Sandblasting is the only way. The acid isn't a good idea either. Been there also.

I'd just Fluid Film the frame twice a year and not worry about it.



GB :)

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 Posted: Wed Oct 17th, 2018 02:36 am
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This is a spray on insulation for the underbody but I dont see why it couldnt be applied to the frame as well. 

http://m.lizardskin.com/index.php?q=car-ceramic-insulation.html

I saw it used here in this episode of project rolling thunder. These guys have lots of tips and use some cool products. They also started with a cool swap to a cluster F on the front suspension and bodywork. If you havent watched the project you should check it out. I watched it all for free by google searching project rolling thunder part#. I'd add the next number on the next search etc. Ther are commercials but the info is worth it.

https://www.powernationtv.com/episode/TK2011-18/project-rolling-thunder-part-13-heat-insulation-exhaust



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 Posted: Wed Oct 17th, 2018 02:47 am
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I've seen the episodes, but I'm telling ya, as a steel worker and mechanic for over two decades, unless you're gonna strip that frame down of ALL accessories/lines/etc AND sandblast it, you're wasting your money and probably making the frame rot out faster in several places that are hard to get at.

I've had this battle myself with Illinois winters vs truck frames, and painting isn't a good option unless you get to bare frame and then sandblast.



GB :)

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 Posted: Wed Oct 17th, 2018 01:32 pm
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Sounds like the classic weak fuel pump = heating up and losing pressure
Fuel above the pump is what keeps it cool
Of course a few posts ago I was thinking crank sensor :P
I have an old saying "It's always the last part you buy that fixes it" meaning diagnosis is key to saving $$$$
Pick your battles
Curious to see what fuel rail pressure is and then when warm and tank is low

bucking and a missin on an engine that normally runs good = fuel issues 90% of the time.
You ether have a weak pump or you have a leak in the in tank plumbing..... time for fuel PSI gauge and to lift the bed

Last edited on Wed Oct 17th, 2018 10:47 pm by 410customs



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